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	<title>Comments on: Note To Timothy Geithner: Do Startups &amp; Venture Capitalists Really Need More Regulation?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/</link>
	<description>...focusing on the evolution and economics of high technology business and strategy.  By day, I am a venture capitalist at Benchmark Capital.</description>
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		<title>By: TheSoak</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-477</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[TheSoak]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 21:52:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-477</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[At what point does government stop regulations of commerce?  What additional oversight does government require to provide for our financial &#039;safety&#039;. The legislation of additional regulations will not improve safety, but only impair the enforcement of what already exists.

Sarbox was a knee jerk reaction to blatant accounting fraud.  Fraud that was covered by existing regulations and ignored by the accounting firms tasked with the audits.  Unfortunately, the Sarbox solution was dictated by the accounting lobby in what could best be described as a CYA effort.

The cost of Sarbox never ends.  The accounting lobby made sure that they were well positioned to pickup the pieces and force their way deeper in to companies.  They now dictate technology requirements proclaiming greater support of Sarbox.  They venture far outside of the financial systems realm and work to dictate standards that are not applicable.  Sarbox gave the accounting firms a self-fulfilling prophecy; they know something is wrong and they are going to find it and you will continue to pay because something will always be wrong.

Now we have the Fed, Treasury and SEC trying to deflect blame for the current crisis to the players on Wall Street and now SHR.  This is not an issue of inheritance.  Geithner was the President of the NY Fed and presided over a miserable failure of his office&#039;s primary role, the regulation of Wall Street.  He did not need broader powers, he needed to enforce the regulations in place and ask questions.

Do venture capitalist need additional regulations?  Absolutely not!  We need the Fed, Treasury and SEC to enforce the existing regulations where applicable regardless of the organizational type.

To my first question; at what point does government stop regulations of commerce?  I have no idea, but hope we all survive the conflicted contradictions in the interim.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At what point does government stop regulations of commerce?  What additional oversight does government require to provide for our financial &#8216;safety&#8217;. The legislation of additional regulations will not improve safety, but only impair the enforcement of what already exists.</p>
<p>Sarbox was a knee jerk reaction to blatant accounting fraud.  Fraud that was covered by existing regulations and ignored by the accounting firms tasked with the audits.  Unfortunately, the Sarbox solution was dictated by the accounting lobby in what could best be described as a CYA effort.</p>
<p>The cost of Sarbox never ends.  The accounting lobby made sure that they were well positioned to pickup the pieces and force their way deeper in to companies.  They now dictate technology requirements proclaiming greater support of Sarbox.  They venture far outside of the financial systems realm and work to dictate standards that are not applicable.  Sarbox gave the accounting firms a self-fulfilling prophecy; they know something is wrong and they are going to find it and you will continue to pay because something will always be wrong.</p>
<p>Now we have the Fed, Treasury and SEC trying to deflect blame for the current crisis to the players on Wall Street and now SHR.  This is not an issue of inheritance.  Geithner was the President of the NY Fed and presided over a miserable failure of his office&#8217;s primary role, the regulation of Wall Street.  He did not need broader powers, he needed to enforce the regulations in place and ask questions.</p>
<p>Do venture capitalist need additional regulations?  Absolutely not!  We need the Fed, Treasury and SEC to enforce the existing regulations where applicable regardless of the organizational type.</p>
<p>To my first question; at what point does government stop regulations of commerce?  I have no idea, but hope we all survive the conflicted contradictions in the interim.</p>
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		<title>By: William Carleton</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-428</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[William Carleton]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 00:19:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-428</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Well argued post.  But I didn’t see anything in Geithner’s prepared remarks that indicated any steps toward regulating the private companies in which venture funds invest.   Rather, the thrust of his concern, and the themes of his remarks, had to do with lack of oversight and recourse over institutions that pool and traffic in other people’s money (and yes “people” meaning not just individual 401(k) contributors but also other sophisticated institutions and investors).  The argument that the VC industry did not use leverage or otherwise do anything bad to precipitate the current crisis is I think to miss at least part of the point:  as I said recently in a post on my blog, good reform might do well to anticipate where (excessively-)creative financial types may migrate when all other avenues are rendered more transparent.  

Geithner put it better in his remarks: “We can’t allow institutions to cherry pick among competing regulators, and shift risk to where it faces the lowest standards and constraints. . . . [O]ur regulatory system must be comprehensive and eliminate gaps in coverage. “

What would be so wrong with investment pools having to register in the same manner that individual investment advisors do?  No one wants innovative, small private companies to have to reveal competitively sensitive information, but we probably do want a financial eco-system that is fully accountable to investors as to how money is managed, and by whom.  This information might also be useful to private companies, too, when assessing the suitability of their prospective investors.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well argued post.  But I didn’t see anything in Geithner’s prepared remarks that indicated any steps toward regulating the private companies in which venture funds invest.   Rather, the thrust of his concern, and the themes of his remarks, had to do with lack of oversight and recourse over institutions that pool and traffic in other people’s money (and yes “people” meaning not just individual 401(k) contributors but also other sophisticated institutions and investors).  The argument that the VC industry did not use leverage or otherwise do anything bad to precipitate the current crisis is I think to miss at least part of the point:  as I said recently in a post on my blog, good reform might do well to anticipate where (excessively-)creative financial types may migrate when all other avenues are rendered more transparent.  </p>
<p>Geithner put it better in his remarks: “We can’t allow institutions to cherry pick among competing regulators, and shift risk to where it faces the lowest standards and constraints. . . . [O]ur regulatory system must be comprehensive and eliminate gaps in coverage. “</p>
<p>What would be so wrong with investment pools having to register in the same manner that individual investment advisors do?  No one wants innovative, small private companies to have to reveal competitively sensitive information, but we probably do want a financial eco-system that is fully accountable to investors as to how money is managed, and by whom.  This information might also be useful to private companies, too, when assessing the suitability of their prospective investors.</p>
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		<title>By: bgurley</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-427</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[bgurley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Apr 2009 18:52:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-427</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[To each of your points:
1. Exchanges outside of the US - in practice this isn&#039;t actually feasible.  if your HQs are in the US, and you have employees in the U.S., and you have over 500 shreholders (which you will if you are public), then you are required to adhere to sarbox regardless of the exchange. I will assume you didn&#039;t know that.
2. I believe the IPO window is open.  ChangeYou went out yesterday.  Rosetta Stone coming.
3. $3mm in sarbox costs does raise the revenue level needed to be profitable -- this is the whole point of the article
4.  Building profitable-lasting companies is always the goal.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To each of your points:<br />
1. Exchanges outside of the US &#8211; in practice this isn&#8217;t actually feasible.  if your HQs are in the US, and you have employees in the U.S., and you have over 500 shreholders (which you will if you are public), then you are required to adhere to sarbox regardless of the exchange. I will assume you didn&#8217;t know that.<br />
2. I believe the IPO window is open.  ChangeYou went out yesterday.  Rosetta Stone coming.<br />
3. $3mm in sarbox costs does raise the revenue level needed to be profitable &#8212; this is the whole point of the article<br />
4.  Building profitable-lasting companies is always the goal.</p>
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		<title>By: Shaddow Bill</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-425</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Shaddow Bill]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Apr 2009 13:02:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-425</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[stop whining and just IPO on another Exchange outside of the US.  if you want to stay in North America, list on the TSX.  AIM in Euopre, etc.  plenty of options and investrs are not usually limited on the exchanges they can invest on. the real complaint should be the lack of good investmetn judgement by VC&#039;s over the past decade.  

My bet, Bill, is that if markets were better and the IPO window was open, you wouldn&#039;t be complaining about Sarbox. You would be flushing companies out into the market as quickly as you could.   

Yes, sarbox is a requirement.  it is a cost of doing business, and understanding your business.   

all of you VC&#039;s love to blame someone else for something.  how many of your companies are profitable?  oh, wait, sorry, none and its all because of Sarbox,  right.  

perhaps the focus should be on building profitable long lasting franchises.  the rest will follow.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>stop whining and just IPO on another Exchange outside of the US.  if you want to stay in North America, list on the TSX.  AIM in Euopre, etc.  plenty of options and investrs are not usually limited on the exchanges they can invest on. the real complaint should be the lack of good investmetn judgement by VC&#8217;s over the past decade.  </p>
<p>My bet, Bill, is that if markets were better and the IPO window was open, you wouldn&#8217;t be complaining about Sarbox. You would be flushing companies out into the market as quickly as you could.   </p>
<p>Yes, sarbox is a requirement.  it is a cost of doing business, and understanding your business.   </p>
<p>all of you VC&#8217;s love to blame someone else for something.  how many of your companies are profitable?  oh, wait, sorry, none and its all because of Sarbox,  right.  </p>
<p>perhaps the focus should be on building profitable long lasting franchises.  the rest will follow.</p>
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		<title>By: ChukChansigOldCasino</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-411</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ChukChansigOldCasino]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Apr 2009 18:44:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-411</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Very good article.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very good article.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: BoomTownBiloxi</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-407</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[BoomTownBiloxi]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Mar 2009 14:43:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-407</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Very good post, I like this blog.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very good post, I like this blog.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: bgurley</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-399</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[bgurley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 01:49:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-399</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yes -- you are correct, an I erred on my math.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes &#8212; you are correct, an I erred on my math.</p>
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		<title>By: bgurley</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-398</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[bgurley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 01:47:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-398</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This is a great question, and one I have been asked many times.  I suppose the biggest reason is the extreme fragmentation of the VC industry.  Most industries with large lobbying groups are highly consolidated (in the real estate case with a monopolistic organization called NAR).  If you own 40-95% of an industry, the ROI from lobbying is fairly obvious.  if you own 1.3%, its harder to rationalize the spend.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a great question, and one I have been asked many times.  I suppose the biggest reason is the extreme fragmentation of the VC industry.  Most industries with large lobbying groups are highly consolidated (in the real estate case with a monopolistic organization called NAR).  If you own 40-95% of an industry, the ROI from lobbying is fairly obvious.  if you own 1.3%, its harder to rationalize the spend.</p>
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		<title>By: Jordan</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-396</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jordan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 22:02:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-396</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sorry, that last comment was meant to have a period at the end, not a question mark.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, that last comment was meant to have a period at the end, not a question mark.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jordan</title>
		<link>http://abovethecrowd.com/2009/03/26/note-to-timothy-geithner-do-startups-venture-capitalists-really-need-more-regulation/#comment-395</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jordan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 22:01:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abovethecrowd.com/?p=204#comment-395</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Did I miss something, or doesn&#039;t a company with $50MM in revenue and a 10% operating margin have $5MM in EBIT, leaving it with only $3-4MM in after-tax earnings? (unless you are counting tax credits from the years of losses).  I don&#039;t mean to pick on the math but to point out that the real cost is more line 75% or more of net income?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did I miss something, or doesn&#8217;t a company with $50MM in revenue and a 10% operating margin have $5MM in EBIT, leaving it with only $3-4MM in after-tax earnings? (unless you are counting tax credits from the years of losses).  I don&#8217;t mean to pick on the math but to point out that the real cost is more line 75% or more of net income?</p>
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